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Recognizing Israel

03 September, 2005

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Pakistan and Israel had their first-ever "official" high-level talks in Istanbul on Thursday in a bid to normalize ties following latter’s pullout from the Gaza Strip.


Though, the meeting was considered the first-ever contact between the two ideological states which do not recognise each other, however, a backdoor diplomacy between the two governments was continuing for last various years. A Karachi-based defence analyst and a senior religious scholar from Lahore had been shuttling between Islamabad and Tel Aviv via Jordan during last four years.


Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom and his Pakistani counterpart Khurshid Kasuri met in Istanbul for what they called ‘historic’ talks arranged after Turkey played a mediating role to bring them together.


At a joint press conference with Mr Shalom, Mr Kasuri hailed the withdrawal of Israeli troops and settlers from the Gaza Strip, which he said constituted a turning point for the establishment of a Palestinian state. However, the Israeli minister did not mention whether the Zionist state is going to pull out from remaining over 130 settlements.


On the other hand, the Palestinian Authority says it is ‘worried’ about Pakistan’s first diplomatic contact with Israel as the Jewish state continues to occupy east Jerusalem and the West Bank.


“It is not good to give Israel gifts before it really implements the peace process, not only in Gaza, but, the West Bank and Jerusalem,” deputy prime minister Nabil Shaath told reporters.


The Islamic Resistance Movement of Hamas has also denounced the meeting and urged Pakistan not to fall into the trap of seeing the Gaza pullout as synonymous with the end of occupation.


Although, Pakistan says its position on the Middle East crisis remains unchanged that calls for an independent Palestinian state with Al Quds as its capital, however, according to analysts, this sudden meeting has raised the doubts that Pakistan may change its stance as it did in case of Kashmir.


Israel has full diplomatic relations with three Arab states — Mauritania, Egypt and Jordan — and a handful of Muslim majority states, including Turkey.

1) Do you think it was the right time to commence dialogue with Israel?


2) What is your opinion about Palestinian leaders’ reaction on the meeting?


3) Do you see any US pressure on Pakistan in this connection.


4) Do you think the move aims to counter the growing Indo-Israel relations? .


5) What kind of reaction General Musharraf may face in the backlash of this new adventure?

Reader Comments:

Give Us bin Laden!

If Musharraf is to risk his political career (and his life) on somthing I would have rather it been by giving us bin Laden than by normalizing relations with Israel.

We all know that bin Laden is hiding out in Pakistan. However we have been reluntant to do anything about it out of the fear that it could destablize Musharraf.

By what could be more destablizing to Musharraf than this? It will just bring more mistrust between Musharraf and the hard line groups in Pakistan. And I don't see much to be gained by it.

If Musharraf can risk his life over this than surely he can risk his life over giving us bin Laden instead of allowing Pakistan to be his hiding place.

Kurt, United Kingdom - 19 September, 2005

It's Time to recognize Israel!!!

Pres. Musharaf is a great leader who has all the great qualities to make his nation and country proud. He have done ever thing to bring back Pakistan from crisis created by our own leaders or abroad. He has proved himself at every front. This time again he is acting proactively and going forward to create relationship with Israel. We all Pakistani's should trust our leader and his instinct and completely support him for this historical move which Pakistan is making under his leadership. We as a nation should stand behind our leader and support him and his decisions who have only one motive in his life and which he have showed in every decision he make so far “Pakistan First” than anything else.
I am as Individual very happy to witness this moments that Pakistan is trying to give PEACE a chance under Pres Musharaf's great leadership and Insha-Allah we will succeed in it.


Ahsan, Pakistan - 19 September, 2005

Pakistan should not sleep

I understan Pakistan can't become a major power player unless Pakistan cosidre a worldwide relations of various nature. Just recently Israel failed to have India attack pakistan. Mr.Peres make two trips to India and Mr. Sharon made one trip to India, but India was smart enough not to get fooled. I am afraid Israel trys very hard to get rid of Pakistan nuclear weapons and for that they might fill with Israeli spies (Mossad) once the relations normalize. Pakistan could not afford sleeping if Israel open an embassy in Islamabad.

Mohammad, Pakistan - 20 September, 2005

An Indian-Israeli Wants to Speak

I was really glad that Pakistan is starting to speak to us. We Israelis are afraid that the Arabs want to destroy us. Unlike what others might think - we have nowhere to go. In many cases - its a do-die situation for us. We want peace - but we also don't trust any nation (including USA) to protect us if we lose. We know we will get slaughtered like 50 years ago. Even today Palestinian leaders call for the complete extermination of Israel. Yes, we may seem cruel at times - but we are not fighting for land but for our lives. Unless others understand that, peace will be hard to achieve. Look at the map and see how tiny Israel is in comparison to its Arab neighbours!

On another note - Pakistan and India can create a world shift if they reach an agreement about Kashmir and I hope they do.

I am in Indian Jew living in Kashmir, and I have always had a soft spot for Pakistan because in many ways your culture is rich and refined! Urdu poetry and ghazals are so heavenly that if only Pakistan cooled down things with India - I am sure it will become a greater nation than it already is. As an Indian, I hope that one day the borders will be completely open and that these two great nations can work together to solve the human problems that they are both facing such as hunger and poverty.

Yaeer, Iraq - 20 September, 2005

Israel vs Arab war is nothing to do with Pakistan

This is a sign we are at last maturing as a nation. Which nation harms itself for another? Certainly our Arab 'friends' never do. How many times have you heard them speak up for Kashmir??


Israel has every right to exist and Israelis have the right to live in peace and with security in their own country safe from Arab terrorism. Pakistan and Israel have no disputes. We should establish formal diplomatic relations with Israel as soon as possible.


Pakistan and Israel can be good friends, and I can't wait for the day we have an Israeli embassy in Islamabad and Pakistani one in Jerusalem.




farhan, Pakistan - 22 September, 2005

THE MAJOR STEP

The major step has been taken by the pakistani authorities i appreciate mr president for his courage and devotion we ll support mr president till the last breath

Ali, Pakistan - 24 September, 2005

Wrong decision

Musharaf can do whatever he likes but We pakistanis in general would never accept Israel. It is not a country in my opinion but only an illegal land grabbing power. the whole of present day israel is actually palestine and there will be absolutely no compromise on that, that should be clear to all parties.

M. Alam, Pakistan - 24 September, 2005

Let it not be forgotten that "Israel" is a Zionist state, NOT a Jewish state, as the media consistently promotes it. Zionism is the new Nazism. You can argue till you are blue in the face about having relations with the Jews (which is allowed historically in Islam), but in "Israel" you are not dealing with orthodox Jewry, rather than its antithesis Zionism. I know Jews who hate Israel because it is Zionist, not Judaic. This warming of relations (Pakistan, Bahrain, Qatar, now we hear Inonesia) is a plot by the West and its Zionist allies to make "Israel" legitimitate in the eyes of the Muslim world. Even the Indians complain that their much-vaunted relationship with this Zionist parasite is strictly a master-slave process, with the "Israelis" very much in the role of master. Only a fool would believe that the Zionists would treat Pakistan (or Muslims generally) any better. The history of Western/Zionist involvement in the Muslim world is testimony to this. What has the West/Zion ever given us other than division and war?

Ali, Pakistan - 27 September, 2005

Abraham's children

Shaking hands and sending a message of goodwill to our Jewish brothers, is probably the greatest of all Mush moves.
Those who oppose such a move, should come up with better then the oft repeated not valid responses. Isreal is a friend, indeed. What did the policy of non-recognition do? did it stop it from doing what it did. What it do, was that made Pakistan be seen as an enemy, which we are certainly not. Everyone has aright to exist and they (Jews) were around much before we as musilim made an entry into the global scene.
Our Holy Prophet made peace with them and entered into agreements with them. Our Holy Book aloows us to marry their women of virtue. The father of our nation asked us to repect the right of minorities as much as our own. Have we ever given a thought to the Jewish minority here and else where.
The Jewish people have as much right as anyone else to live and be respected, Pakistan has done the right thing by sending them a message of goodwill , for we do have much in common, . For it is only the blessing of the Creator of the Universes that we are around. We must always remember that the Mullah of most flavours was opposed to our comming into being as a seperate and independent state. Do they do anything but oppose and point and wag fingers, like pay taxes or do some good.
Shalom.

Malik Shahid, Pakistan - 28 September, 2005

Abraham's children

Shaking hands and sending a message of goodwill to our Jewish brothers, is probably the greatest of all Mush moves.
Those who oppose such a move, should come up with better then the oft repeated not valid responses. Isreal is a friend, for they did help us when we asked for it. A friend in need is a friend indeed. What did the policy of non-recognition do? did it stop it from doing what it did. What it do, was that made Pakistan be seen as an enemy, which we are certainly not. Everyone has aright to exist and they (Jews) were around much before we as musilim made an entry into the global scene.
Not recognizing them amounts to not recognizing our own selves. Our Holy Prophet made peace with them and entered into agreements with them. Our Holy Book aloows us to marry their women of virtue. The father of our nation asked us to repect the right of minorities as much as our own. Have we ever given a thought to the Jewish minority here and else where.
The Jewish people have as much right as anyone else to live and be respected, for have they not proven to be far more disciplined and enterprising then the rest of us.
Pakistan has done the right thing by sending them a message of goodwill and we have much to learn from them, for we do have much in common, the y consider them the blessed ones and so do we. For it is only the blessing of the Creator of the Universes that we are around. For the mad ignorant mullah and Jihadi Joes have tried their best to ruin us. We must always remember that the Mullah of most flavours was opposed to our comming into being as a seperate and independent state. Do they do anything but oppose and point and wag fingers, like pay taxes or do some good.
Shalom.

Malik Shahid, Pakistan - 28 September, 2005

Israel Diplomatic Relations

1) Do you think it was the right time to commence dialogue with Israel?

This is peek time for Pakistan to establish relations with Israel. Even though I am not a fan of the Pakistan Military Dictatorship, it is a great moment to seize the moment and do it under a Military Dictator rather than civilian rule, because the military understands the importance of military ties between nations and therefore strengthens it's own defense better, while maintaining it's Nuclear Assets. Plus, a civilian leader always fears public opinion as it could favor against that civilian leader. Therefore, President Musharraf is the leader to take action towards diplomatic relations between Israel.




2) What is your opinion about Palestinian leaders' reaction on the meeting?

I am glad that President Abu Abbas has commended the efforts of Pakistan in this process. The opinion of Hamas, Hisbullah, and Islamic Jihad are not relevant to me as they are uncivilized organizations who promote hate over love. Pakistan having diplomatic relations with Israel will actually encourage the creation of a Palestinian State. Israel fears the Arab World for what happened in the 1960s when neighbor countries tried to invade Israel, therefore it has build up a strong military because of it. The Arab world was never with us in regards to Kashmir, why should we help them in their cause when they have ignored us. Yet, we will help create the State of Palestine through diplomatic relations with Israel.


3) Do you see any US pressure on Pakistan in this connection.

No, There are other Muslim nations who do not have full diplomatic relations with Israel who are just as close to Israel. Pakistan did it for it's own security, and for the advancement of Pakistan. This will increase the economy of Pakistan, and the advancement of Pakistan while increasing security in the Middle East. If China, and Japan and ASEAN nations have relations with Israel, why can not Pakistan?


4) Do you think the move aims to counter the growing Indo-Israel relations? .

That is part of it, but Pakistan is doing it for it's own strength and it's own advancement. Specially in the fields of Economics, Culture, Social, and Political aspects. Pakistan has two options: Be a Leader or be a Follower, It can lead the Islamic World or Follow the Islamic World.


5) What kind of reaction General Musharraf may face in the backlash of this new adventure?

President General Musharraf will receive a good response by the majority of educated Pakistanis, and those who are true patriots of Pakistan. The Mullahs hurt advancement, we must overcome the fear of the Mullahs and work towards diplomatic relations between Pakistan and Israel. For the sake of all the people and for the sake of the Middle East. Friends solve problems, enemies never solve problems.


Munzir Naqvi, United Kingdom - 29 September, 2005

Recognizing Israel

I am humbled by the support of your readers for creating dialogue between Israel and Pakistan. As an American Jew, I am moved that your readers are so open-minded to the recognition of Israel, as Israel is for Pakistan, and for the development of a relationship between the two countries. Islam and Judaism are the two great Abrahamic faiths with shared rich history and traditions. As many of your readers indicated, there is so much to gain with a relationship between the two countries. And through this relationship, a greater understanding can occur which has far reaching potential. Already, there has been an initiative called the Pakistan-Israel Peace Forum ( www.pakistanisraelpeace.org) which promotes the alliance between Israel and Pakistan at the grassroots level. Please consider signing the Petition for peace at their website.

I have read with understanding the concerns that many have with the Palestinian-Israeli conflict. It may surprise your readers to hear that virtually all Israelis and Jews worldwide desperately want peace with the Palestinians – and it will come - but the momentum has to start somewhere. Perhaps it will start in Pakistan. That your readers invite the relationship shows true interest and yearning for peace. People in Israel are looking to build links with Muslim countries. The more dialogues that we have, the better ability we will have to bring peace abound.

There is so much strife in the world and there is a definite need to change the course that we seem to be set upon. The relationship between Pakistan and Israel has much fruit to bear; and with that, the hope that peace will spread among the nations of the world.


Michael Berenhaus, United Kingdom - 02 October, 2005

Musharaf is hypocrat

Pakistan Army decieved the entire nation in maintaining secret contacts with Israel while supported 'hate israel' policy durig all these times and now making the friendship public. If we are going to be friends with India and Israel, then Pakistan must cut short the size of Army by 3/4th. This will be a great favour to the poor nation of Pakistan.

Sunny, Pakistan - 03 October, 2005

What Israel is trying ....

What Israel is trying is to open an embassy in Islamabad and fill it with the Mossad members. Who doesn't know that Israli embassy employess are Mossads. Pakistan first should think about the Israeli spying status around the world. If Israeli mossads are spying on United States, don't you think they will still the Pakistani nuclear weapons in a day light? That is what Israel is after. Israel wants to hanve hand on Pakistani nuclear weapons. Good Luck to Pakistan.

Mohammad Khan, Pakistan - 03 October, 2005

Israel

Do not mention of "Arab States and their local problems". Pakistan is an independent country and should act as an "Independent". She should have normal relations with Israel and India long time ago.

Azam Hasan Zaidi, Canada - 05 October, 2005

Remember History

Well the history says it all. We have a glorious muslim history and it tells us that whenever we did good they did bad. how can we be friends? thats absurd. Even the frndship drama with India is full of BS. Im a university going student and understand this dirty politics. Theres no benefit to Pakistan with these selfish friendships. Haven't you seen what we reaped after having a friendship with US. If i were the president of Pakistan i would have not met the israeli's PM. Whats the point in showing the world that we care. Do we even care? we dont. we should not. We are different people with different ideas and societal forces. PAkistani Government has gone crazy. first we had the politicians now we have Army to rule. its goes in circles. Frankly speaking i do not care about the palestinians.. First make your ownself stable to protect urself and be econmically strong and then go out and solve the worlds problems.. the main problem in pak right now is our own people. Everyone wants to leave pak.. Why ? no one cares about it. We should. Pakistan is a new gangsta paradise. We should chnage our ways before its too late. i live in canada. i know how it is to live here. Pakistan used to be a jannat. now its worse than hell. Change people.. Wake up.. its high time to change before we end up falling apart.
Thankyou very much for hearing me out. Peace. Miss Pakistan.

Gulbakht, Pakistan - 08 October, 2005

as most of the readers do not study the holy doctrines of the holy quran which are clearly being said about the jews and thier behaviour. in the light of the holy quran and the ever said practicable sayings of the holy prophet[p.b.u.h.],we should be very careful in seeking contacts with jews because they are not trustworthy as the history tells us.as we do know that all the dis-believers are formulated in one nation.how is it possible that they will behave with muslims in fair and just manner.the enlightened moderates should think ove it if they can.

mahr sohail ahmed, Pakistan - 08 October, 2005

as most of the readers do not study the holy doctrines of the holy quran which are clearly being said about the jews and thier behaviour. in the light of the holy quran and the ever said practicable sayings of the holy prophet[p.b.u.h.],we should be very careful in seeking contacts with jews because they are not trustworthy as the history tells us.as we do know that all the dis-believers are formulated in one nation.how is it possible that they will behave with muslims in fair and just manner.the enlightened moderates should think ove it if they can.

mahr sohail ahmed, Pakistan - 08 October, 2005

I'm a proud pakistani and agree with the kashmir dispute and palestinian dispute as a muslim. In my opinion i feel that we should look at our own mind and stop caring about others until they start caring about us.
We should start full trade with Isreal and full ties. One this will benifet us hugely and secondly will create more jobs, investment etc..
The reason behind this is our biggest dispute most pakistani should look at is Kashmir. Cause of this there is allot of tension with India, yet we have noone offically support this cause. All our muslim nations have full relations and trade with India and could care less about kashmir. Even palestine has a realation with India, yet us being typical pakistanis get involved in all other matter and have no realation with Isreal.
Its time us Pakistanis wake up and start full trade with Isreal and stop worrying about palestinian. This will send a strong message to all the muslim countries. If countries like KSA, Iran, Palestine, UAE, IRAQ etc.. complain we should simply mention the fact they have full trade with India and till they stop it like Isreal we will do.
Pakistan needs to stand strong on the kashmir dispute or nothing will be done and no one will care about the dispute. It deserves to be with its muslim brother Pakistan or be independent.

Atif, Canada - 09 October, 2005

Israelis Killed Gen. Zia, Claims Ex-US Amabassador

KARACHI, 4 December 2005 — The Israeli secret agency Mossad most probably killed Gen. Zia ul- Haq, suspects John Gunther Dean, who was the American ambassador to India in 1988, according to an article in the latest issue of World Policy Journal by Barbara Crossette, who was the South Asia Bureau Chief of the New York Times from 1988 to 1991.

When Dean expressed his views to the State Department at the time and insisted on a thorough investigation of the Israeli-Indian axis, he was accused of mental imbalance and relieved of his duties.

Dean was a distinguished diplomat who has garnered more ambassadorships than most envoys. He had strong opinions and years of valuable experience. As an independent thinker, he often had problems being a good “diplomat”.

Dean believes that the Israelis wanted to stop Pakistan's military from making nuclear weapons. They had attacked Iraq's nuclear facilities at Osirak in 1981 and believed Zia when he declared in 1987 that Pakistan was a “screwdriver's turn away from the bomb”.

Dean, now 80, has remained silent for nearly 20 years but is now collecting his papers and is ready to share his thoughts. He was declared mentally unfit for demanding an investigation into the aircrash. He lost his medical clearance and security clearance because of his views and was forced to seek retirement in 1988.

After he made the charge following the aircrash in which the then US ambassador to Pakistan, Arnie Raphel was also killed with Zia, he was sent to Switzerland to “rest” for six weeks and only then allowed to return to New Delhi to pack his bags and quit.

He is now opening the case because he wants to clear the charge of “mental imbalance” and ask the questions that have long remained buried about the aircrash that killed Zia.

Dean says that when he was ambassador to India, various pro-Israel Congressmen and other US policymakers constantly asked him why he wasn't cooperating with the Israelis to thwart Pakistan's nuclear program and demonize Pakistan.

He says he was asked to persuade the Indians to be more pro-Israel too. He is on record as having alleged that the Israelis tried to kill him in 1980 when he was US ambassador to Lebanon because he disagreed with Israeli policies. He was accused of being “pro-Palestinian” in the Israeli Knesset (Parliament).

The US did not allow the FBI or any other agency to carry out a full-fledged investigation into the crash


wasi siddiqui, Pakistan - 04 December, 2005

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